How the art of conversation leads to opportunities, collabs & referrals
In today's episode of Process to Profitability, I had the pleasure of talking with Rachael Cumberland-Dodd about the power of conversations and how they can lead to incredible opportunities, collaborations, and referrals. Rachael emphasizes the significance of actively scheduling time for marketing activities and making meaningful connections. We discuss the importance of being genuine, treating online interactions the same as offline relationships, and having both instinct and strategy in networking. Rachael shares her insights on developing a unique point of view, identifying like-minded individuals, and reaching out to people every day. We also explore the value of clarifying our intentions and creating connections with those who share our philosophy and values. Listen in as we dive into the art of conversation and how it can transform the way we approach marketing and business growth.
Timestamps:
[00:02:22] Meet Rachael
[00:04:48] Conversation is the missing link in business today
[00:08:02] Setting your intentions for connecting with people
[00:10:33] The value of good conversations
[00:12:49] The importance of having a point of view
[00:16:34] Choosing the right people to connect with
[00:19:35] How to reach out to people you want to connect with
[00:22:04] Nurturing the relationships that you've built
[00:26:31] Building connections is a long-term strategy
[00:28:22] Diving deeper and listening to your intuition
[00:30:20] Connect with Rachael
Key Topics:
Actively schedule time for marketing activities and make genuine connections
Treat online interactions the same as offline relationships, be thoughtful and genuine
Be a gardener and farmer, scatter seeds in conversations and connections
Focus on quality connections and conversations, not just numbers and metrics
Develop a unique point of view to stand out and attract attention in marketing
Identify people who share your philosophy, approach, or values for collaborations
Bring back the art of conversation and connection in the online business space
Clarify your intention and goals in conversations for effective and meaningful connections
Resources:
[00:00:00] Samantha Mabe: If you are feeling like you are tired of having to market the same way everybody else does, or you just want to make some real connections with people, today's episode is for you.
[00:00:14] Rachael and I got connected through a mutual friend and had a coffee chat that led to this podcast. And that's part of why I thought she would be a great fit to come on today and talk with us about the art of how conversation leads to opportunities, collaborations, and referrals.
[00:00:35] We talk about all types of relationships and how important they are in a time of online business and ai and really surface level conversations. Rachael shares with us how she has used conversations and relationships to grow her business and how she's reached out to some of the people she really looks up to in her industry and made connections that have then helped her to be a guest on podcast or show up for other people's communities.
[00:01:13] The biggest takeaway from this conversation that I had is that it's not as scary as you think it is to reach out to somebody. All you have to do is reply to an email or an Instagram post with a really authentic question or comment that shows that you took the time to read and listen and learn from somebody else.
[00:01:38] We also talk about how when you're looking at building these relationships and you are wanting to create a community, it's not just about getting clients. There is a long-term goal to grow your business, of course, but you're really looking to reach out to people who have similar values, who can cheer you on in this online business space.
[00:02:05] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd is an ex corporate marketer turned niche-whisperer and messaging guide. She helps purposeful business owners get to the heart of what they do, why they do it, and for whom, so they can market their mission with more ease and less urgh.
Meet Rachael
[00:02:22] Samantha Mabe: Hi Rachael. Thanks for joining me today.
[00:02:25] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Hello, how are you?
[00:02:28] Samantha Mabe: I'm excited to chat. I read your official bio at the beginning of the episode, but can you tell us a little bit more about you and how you got into your business and how you got to what you're doing now?
[00:02:41] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Okay. I class myself as an accidental entrepreneur 'cause I was a corporate marketer through and through until I realized that I didn't like it anymore. Their values didn't align with my values. And so I thought I'm just gonna leave. And I trotted around with my CV to all the other sort of big marketing companies in my area, and they all the same. It was same shit, different logo.
[00:03:06] When I say same shit, it meant that they weren't prioritizing the human. I didn't see as a marketeer, we were able to make a difference and that was really important to me. I wanted to make a difference, so I just had this moment of hey, I'll just start my business and everything will be fine. Golly. I wouldn't advise just going, oh, I'll just start my own business without much of a plan. But Hey, we're here now. Four years on. We're still here.
[00:03:32] Samantha Mabe: Yeah. So who do you work with mostly?
[00:03:35] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Mostly it's coaches, consultants, leaders, teachers, and it is very much the people that we know that want to really make an impact in the world. They wanna do good in their community, for the planet, for the world. But they struggle to take all that amazing stuff that they do for clients every day, and they struggle with actually putting words around it, explaining it, and putting it front and center. So that's what I really love to do.
[00:04:05] I love finding the golden threads between people so they can explain what they do, why they do it, and who they do it for. So it can just go out and market with ease and attract all the clients that they want, who can make an impact with them. Yeah, that's why I help people explain themselves, I think in a nutshell.
[00:04:26] Samantha Mabe: I think that's so important that you mentioned you work with people who really want to make an impact, and that's who my clients are. And I think that's why our topic today is so helpful is because we're talking about collaborations and relationships and getting beyond just seeing people as a number to hit your marketing goals and your revenue goals.
Conversation is the missing link in business today
[00:04:48] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Yeah, definitely. For sure. And it's almost like how marketing and business growth happened in the olden days. It's literally those conversations that you would have in the marketplace, in the town square. You would have conversations that weren't related to always, oh, buy my apples, buy my whatever. They were like, oh, how's x and X doing? Or, I see you're building a house, or, how was your holiday? Or, it was about relationship building.
[00:05:16] It was about making a genuine connection, having a conversation, which ultimately for so many of them, led to a sale because a relationship was formed. And that's really, I think the missing source in so much of the conversation or lack of conversations that's happening in the world today.
[00:05:33] We've lost the art of conversation. We've lost the art of connection in favor of algorithms and tactics and all the other things that we're supposed to do in the internet online world. So let's bring it back. Let's bring back the art of conversation and connection.
[00:05:54] Samantha Mabe: Yeah. It's so funny to me when you think about that, right? Because we clearly know how to use Google, we could find whatever service we want, but we are much more likely to hire somebody who a friend knows them and went to them and we had a conversation. We ran into each other at the park with our kids playing. Of course you're more likely to hire them. But in our own business, we don't get out and do that for ourselves.
[00:06:18] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Yeah. It's almost like that missing link, isn't it?
[00:06:20] I haven't really thought about that before. Yeah. If you think about the last person that you bought something with, bought something from, it was definitely a connection or it was a referral. That's what it was.
[00:06:33] Just thinking back to the last sort of online course I brought and it was a referral. Someone said, ' this person's brilliant. I've done the course.' So why are we not putting down seeds to have those referral conversations and those kind of meeting of minds?
[00:06:50] Samantha Mabe: And as we are getting more into AI, I've been having lots of conversations about AI and all of that, people really value real connection.
[00:07:00] I think we can tell when something is a real connection or if it's a computer and it feels like a slower way to grow your business through relationships, but once you look back on it and you're like, I've cultivated this really wonderful community of clients and connections and referrals. It fits our way of doing business and our passion for people a lot better to do this as well.
[00:07:25] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Absolutely. Definitely. I think if we could grow our business by referrals only, by having the right conversations with the right people without any going anywhere near social media or slogging out a blog, God wouldn't that be amazing.
[00:07:38] Not saying that content isn't important. I really believe that the art of writing and creating is super important for any business owner. It's almost like the focus is always on the social. It's always on the churn, feeding the machine.
[00:07:53] Let's switch it and let's start putting some focus on actually being more intentional about having conversations with people and the right people.
Setting your intentions for connecting with people
[00:08:02] Samantha Mabe: So how do you figure out who those right people are to connect with?
[00:08:07] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Yeah, definitely. We'll get getting to the juice. So I think the first thing for me that's really important is to check your intention.
[00:08:15] So it's very easy to start having conversations with people and think, 'oh I wanna get clients. This is what I'm doing it for.' To take all those things that you we're used to on the internet, like posting stuff to get engagement and feedback and transfer that over to the art of conversations.
[00:08:34] And that almost is the death nail that kills anything. So I think the first thing is really to lay in and check your intention. What am I doing this for?
[00:08:45] And the bottom line is, you are not doing this to get sales. I am not saying that sales don't happen, I've got bags of evidence they do, but you can smell when someone's being transactional about a relationship or transactional about a conversation as opposed to just being open and just saying hello for the sake of it.
[00:09:05] So firstly, I'll definitely check your intention and when I thought about when I started doing this, I was just like, ' what is my intention? What do I want this to do?'
[00:09:15] So firstly, I was entering into this world of marketing, which is very different from my corporate marketing. This world, this new world I was entering in was talking about ethical conscious marketing, and I had no idea how to do that because I've come from corporate land. I was thinking like, 'I need to learn from those people who are amazing at this. I need to learn some marketing tactics from these amazing people who are doing it in the way that I want to do it.'
[00:09:42] And then I thought, 'you know what? The other thing I really miss is collaborating.' So again, in the corporate world, I had a big team. There's loads of people around us and we'd share ideas and create together, and I bloody miss that, really miss that. So I thought, 'I wanna collaborate, I wanna do things like this. Have conversations with people I admire.'
[00:10:01] And then I thought the other thing I wanna do is have referrals. So I wanna be able to be that person that says, 'ah, I can help. I know this amazing website designer. There she is. There's her details.' I wanted to be that connector person as well. And really, yes, I wanted people to refer me too.
[00:10:18] So that was the first port of call, and that's what I'd recommend everyone did. Just think about what is it you want from these conversations you're gonna have, what's your intention?
The value of good conversations
[00:10:33] Samantha Mabe: I really like that you started not with, oh, I'm gonna reach out to people who I want to be my clients, but I'm gonna reach out to people who I can learn from, who I can contribute to, who are like a mutual good fit. Instead of feeling like, 'oh, all of this has to go into clients and revenue and bottom line', because ultimately it's going to get there. But those relationships can be so much more valuable than just one client that comes in the door.
[00:11:03] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Oh, for sure. And I think having rich, fruitful, meaningful conversations with people is super valuable. It helps you shape what you think. If someone's got a different point of view, they challenge you, you challenge them.
[00:11:21] Having people that you admire, that you wanna learn from or wanna collaborate with who are either challenging you or questioning you or asking you to explain, I think it is just a wonder.
[00:11:31] And sometimes I come off conversations, coffee dates with people, and I'm thinking, oh God, I'm so tired I can't have another conversation. And then I am blown away by the beauty, and the depth, and the richness, and the interesting. Ideas are going, I've got that idea for content. Or I know someone that would really admire, would wanna work for you, or have you thought about this person? It's just such a beautiful thing.
[00:11:55] Samantha Mabe: And there's such value in that, whether it's like just a quick coffee chat or if it's more of a long-term relationship, learning from somebody else and also sharing your expertise. And I think we have been taught, or we feel, if we give a lot of that away, then we're not gonna get value back.
[00:12:15] But I think if you can showcase and just in a conversation helping somebody out, like what you're really good at and how you help your clients and how you think about things, it makes you a lot easier for people to refer because they know you more than just, okay, she's a website designer and she works on Squarespace.
[00:12:35] Those are like the checkbox things, but it's no, I actually had a really good conversation. I learned a lot. Clearly she's passionate about this, and those are gonna be deeper relationships for us and then more beneficial long term.
The importance of having a point of view
[00:12:49] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Yeah, definitely. And I think one of the things when I was thinking about this conversation, I went through what's the most important things that we need to have in our back pocket in order to have meaningful, intentional conversations?
[00:13:01] And one of the things I was thinking of was: have a point of view, exactly as you said there. When you have a conversation with someone and they laid down something that you've either never heard before or they've presented something in a interesting or a new way, you're like, 'oh wow, gosh, I never really thought of it like that.' then you can become that girl who has this idea, has this point of view, has this mission, wants to share this kind of idea.
[00:13:27] Having a point of view, I think, is one of those things that is not talked about enough. There's a few people in the sort of ethical conscious marketing space that talk about it and they're really good at it.
[00:13:36] Like Tadd Hargrave from Marketing for Hippies. He's like the godfather of it, but it's almost the thing that separates us from just another messaging coach or just another web designer.
[00:13:49] What we do is not so dissimilar to what a lot of people do, but we've got a point of view and a philosophy that is imbued all the way through our work, and that's uncopyable.
[00:14:04] So you know, it's not an easy thing to find, just go and find your point of view. It's not oh, pick it up and there it is. It does take a bit of work, but in all aspects of your marketing actually having a clear point view, having a philosophy, approach, something you're really passionate about is an absolute win.
[00:14:21] I share my marketing as medicine message to a lot of people that I speak to and they always lean in. They always go, 'God, that's interesting. What's that about?' And I've known people have referred me as, 'oh, she's the one that talks about marketing as medicine.' I think it's hugely important.
[00:14:41] Samantha Mabe: Yeah, I know I had a client that when I asked her afterwards why she hired me, she said, 'because I know your philosophy behind sales and you're not gonna create a website that like pushes people into buying what they don't need.'
[00:14:55] And while, I haven't sat down and been like, 'okay, what's my point of view?' it comes through in your work and the way that you talk. And you mentioned if you find things that you really don't like or things that you're really drawn to and that builds that up.
[00:15:12] And I'm sure coming from the corporate world, you had because we have to be willing to have people say no to us because we're not a right fit. I'm sure coming from a corporate world, it's more of ' we're not gonna have a point of view. We're gonna take anybody who comes along.' So was that a big shift for you to like really put your philosophy out there?
[00:15:34] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Yeah. Oh my gosh. You've got no idea. That's a whole chapter of the book.
[00:15:39] In essence, because the corporate world you are a success if you blend in, if you say the same thing as everyone else, if you tow the line if you meet your KPIs, the management. Then you're a success and that means you get paid more, you get promoted.
[00:15:57] All of that is absolutely useless when we start the entrepreneurial journey because we have to have a point of view. We have to be rebellious around things. We have to stand out.
[00:16:06] You can't really see it, but this poster behind me says 'Odd one out 'and you can see the green cup in the sea of blue cups. And I brought that when I was in corporate and I just thought, 'oh, that's cute.' I liked it. But actually it's because I felt like an odd one out because I did have something to say and I was a bit annoying and I didn't really, didn't really align with all the company values and so I had to leave.
Choosing the right people to connect with
[00:16:34] Samantha Mabe: So as we are looking to grow these relationships and reach out to people and build collaborations and referrals, do you have any tips on how to make that first contact with somebody? And then we can talk about like how we keep those relationships going as well?
[00:16:53] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Yeah, sure. Before we do that, I think it's important to say who are those right people because we could talk to everyone, couldn't we? And I love a conversation. I think it's hugely rewarding for me. So I guess I could talk to everyone, but actually I haven't got the time to talk to everyone. This is not gonna help my business if I talk to everyone.
[00:17:17] So I think the first thing to be is just be more strategic about the people we wanna talk to. And I grouped into three sort of different areas or groups of people that you could talk to.
[00:17:28] So the first thing I did was, because I was exiting the corporate world, going into this world of conscious ethical marketing and business for good. And I was like 'who else can I learn from? Who else, understands this?'
[00:17:42] So I think the first thing to do is think about what your philosophy or your mission is, and then just start researching it. So for me, I typed in marketing for good or ethical marketing into Google. And then suddenly I got all these articles of blog posts that have been written, and then I followed the kind of rabbit holes through there.
[00:18:04] And basically made a huge list of all these people, went on their website, looked at their socials, got a feel for what they were talking about, and it then it got very in intuitive. I had all these people, some of them I'm just ' oh my God, you're amazing. I absolutely love you. I love your vibe. I love what you're saying.' Others are a bit like 'eh, you're okay.' So I very much went strategic. Who shares the philosophy? But also, who do I really gel with? Who do I vibe with?
[00:18:35] So I made a big old list of those people. And a great example of a story to support this is: there's a lady called Sarah Santa Croquet, she's got the Humane Marketing Circle and has written business books called Marketing like We're Human and Selling Like We're Human. She's all about community, all about doing business for good. I came across her work, completely, fell in love with her. I said that. I love you. Literally really fangirled around her. And then we started having conversations. We had a coffee date. It ended up where she invited me to do a webinar to her circle, her community.
[00:19:10] And this is the beauty of it. All I did was just go, ' I really like your work and I want to learn from you. And oh my gosh, I'm so pleased.' I basically said, 'I've just come from corporate marketing and this is so refreshing to hear this.' I was very gushing actually. It's quite embarrassing now when you think about it. But yeah, the beauty unfolded. It was lovely.
[00:19:28] So yeah, that's the first thing I do. Who are the people that share your philosophy or your approach or your values?
How to reach out to people you want to connect with
[00:19:35] Samantha Mabe: So once you had that list, I know you mentioned like you reached out to her because you had read her work and you'd seen that, how do you do that? Do you like send a cold email? Do you start commenting on Instagram?
[00:19:47] I think that's where we all get hung up, especially if we feel like, 'oh, this person is like the pinnacle of what I wanna reach out to' and we feel so intimidated to start that conversation.
[00:19:59] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Yeah. And when I went on and I had a look at Sarah, I felt she was very approachable. She wasn't Brene Brown kind of level where I was just like, 'wow. She's like amazing and super busy and she's not gonna give a crap if I say anything to her.' But I got the impression she was very approachable.
[00:20:17] And so that's the other thing you can look at. Who are those people who are three or four steps ahead of you? Not stratospheric. Who are those people that are on the same journey as you, but a little bit further ahead?
[00:20:26] So what did I do? I literally and genuinely reached out. I made a connection request on LinkedIn and said, 'gosh, I'm so pleased to have found your work 'cause I've just left corporate marketing and I'm feeling like I'm the only one to having this why is marketing so shit conversation.'
[00:20:46] And she's very graciously responded with, 'wow, thanks.' And then obviously I followed her and commented on her work and was genuinely appreciative of her work. So it's all gotta be genuine.
[00:21:04] Samantha Mabe: A lot of times we have to remember, those people probably don't hear from people as much as we think they do. And so when it comes across, they're gonna recognize that and they're gonna say, 'oh wow, they really did read my work and it was impactful. Or they really have this mutual connection.'
[00:21:21] And so it's not as intimidating as we make it out to be if we're looking three to four steps ahead and not, I wanna connect with Oprah on my cold email that I'm gonna send.
[00:21:32] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Yeah, absolutely. I agree.
[00:21:34] I have this conversation with my clients when I'm talking about how to make connections. First thing, like I said, is to be incredibly genuine about it.
[00:21:42] But also, flip it. How would you feel if someone reached out to you that was an apprentice or a junior, or hadn't been in business very long, or, and just was very genuinely said, 'gosh, I love your work.' What would you think? You wouldn't be like, 'oh my god, what a loser.' You would be genuinely excited.
Nurturing the relationships that you've built
[00:22:04] Samantha Mabe: So how do you then continue these relationships if that person writes back and you started that connection, how do you continue to build those and foster those?
[00:22:13] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Yeah. Yeah. This is the sort of where the magic is really. It's about actively putting it in your diary as this is the time that I am doing my connection. It is your marketing, essentially. It's your marketing activity instead of posting on social. If you can take that time and then just use it as your connection activity.
[00:22:33] And so things that I've done is joined mailing lists. So if it's someone I really liked, I've signed up for their mailing list or downloaded their freebie, and then I've replied to their emails. If their email lands and it feels important and you've got something to say, then reply to it and tell people it's wonderful.
[00:22:52] The other ways to keep your conversation going is to, and I've spent money with these people that I really like, I've accessed their entry level course. So either learnt from them in a one-to-one or been a group program of them.
[00:23:07] I continue to comment on their work. If they post a story then I respond if it feels right. So we've got that conversation happening in the DMs as well.
[00:23:18] One of the other things that I've done is I've offered to share some of their work. So you know, if they've got a course happening or they've got some kind of initiative or they're running a webinar, I would say, 'Hey, I'd love to share. I'd love your work and I'd love to share this with my audience. Can I have a link or, you happy for me to do that?' And nine times outta 10 people are like, 'yeah, of course. Thank you.'
[00:23:43] This is where the art comes in, this is where it's not scientific. And this is where, if you had a friend or someone you just met and you wanted to get to know them a bit better, what would you do? If you saw on the street, you'd compliment them on their shoes or you'd send them a message after they'd sent their picture of their holiday on Instagram going, 'how was your holiday?' You'd just be thoughtful and genuine.
[00:24:07] And I think this is what trips people up. It's almost like they've forgotten how to be thoughtful and genuine online. And it's exactly the same as you treat a relationship offline. There ain't no difference.
[00:24:23] Samantha Mabe: Yeah. I love the tip about joining somebody's email list because it's an automatic reminder. Their email comes in, oh, that really resonated, and all we have to do is take the time to write a quick two sentence reply.
[00:24:36] I read every email response that I get. I respond to them all. They go into a folder in my inbox, so they are valuable .
[00:24:44] I've really been trying, when I see a friend on Instagram or a connection on Instagram with a post that I'm like, 'oh, that's really good'. Instead of just thinking that in my head, I'll do a comment for them because that's gonna help 'em with the algorithm.
[00:24:58] But it's like just those couple extra seconds can mean a lot to them. And a lot of times we're already there. We're already scrolling social media, so why not hit like on a post? Or you're already reading the email, why not hit reply and send them something?
[00:25:14] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Yeah. I love that whole putting it in your head instead of just like saying, oh, that was brilliant, what they've written. Actually say it.
[00:25:23] And this is why it doesn't have to be like bloody revolutionary. It doesn't have to be the most and you've spent hours on it crafting this perfect message.
[00:25:33] And I think what the good thing is about when you put a message on Insta or LinkedIn or any platform, the other people who are following this person see it. And then you can have a side conversation with someone who again, might agree and not agree with you.
[00:25:47] What we need to remember is like attracts like. So if this person that your original poster that you absolutely love and encourage, she is, he is gonna have a whole kind of audience of people who feel similar, think similar, do the same, or from the same cloth. Magic can happen on a side conversation as well. That's definitely been my experience.
[00:26:12] Samantha Mabe: Yeah, and it's good for me to remember too, like I think we occasionally go into these and we say, oh I like this person. I wanna reach out, but I'm hoping they'll invite me on their podcast, or I'm hoping that there's this outcome. And sometimes that can take years to get to that goal of what you wanted the relationship to be.
Building connections is a long-term strategy
[00:26:31] Samantha Mabe: And so we just have to continue to build and reach out and not go in with the expectation of, 'oh, I'm gonna reach out and this person's gonna have me on their podcast and I'm gonna get a million followers and make all this money' because that's not like the genuine reason to reach out.
[00:26:51] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Indeed. Yeah, absolutely. This is not a short-term strategy, this is a long play. This is, you start planting the seeds and this is all it is. It's about being a gardener and then a farmer. You scatter the seeds and some of them will land on really fertile, rich soil and some of them won't. Some of them will just get eaten by the birds.
[00:27:10] And this is why it's almost like a sort of a numbers game. I don't wanna bring it back just to numbers 'cause it's about conversation and quality.
[00:27:18] I think going in the expectation of some of the people that I'm going to connect with, are just gonna send me an emoji and and it won't go anywhere else.
[00:27:27] Others, our conversation now is an example of this, isn't it? We had a introduced by a mutual friend, had a conversation, talked about our philosophy, and now we're talking about this in a public forum, a podcast. When I looked at your website and wanted to get to know you, I wasn't going, 'oh yes, I'm gonna be on podcast one day.' It was just like, oh, she's cool. I like the name of her business.'
[00:27:54] It's really trying to dial down that whole, I want clients, I want visibility. I want to be on podcasts. This is all about, 'Hey, I just want a conversation with an interesting person who shares the same philosophy approach to business that I do.'
[00:28:11] Samantha Mabe: I love that. Alright, any final tips or things you've seen that have worked really well here before we wrap up?
Diving deeper and listening to your intuition
[00:28:22] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: I think one of the things, and I'm gonna plug this book 'cause I absolutely love it. It's called The Widest Net by a lady called Pamela Slim. She's put everything that I've been thinking into a book that I can just use. It's about finding the untapped potential in your connections. And it's a really good kind of approach, a methodology, or a journey that she takes you through that's similar to what I've been discussing here, but obviously, a little bit more in depth. So that's a really good read if someone's interested in this.
[00:28:52] And a lot of what I've learned has been my own kind of instinct, like I'm just gonna chat and see what happens. But also then making it more strategic.
[00:29:04] And so I guess one of the things, in order to bring it back to how do I do this? How often do I do this? I would suggest that, you firstly make a bit of a plan, do that research, or who are the people that I really would like to learn from?
[00:29:18] One of the other things that I find is really important's, like my ideal clients, who else are they wanting to learn from? So in my experience, my ideal clients are coaches, consultants, et cetera. Generally they would go to someone like you 'cause they need a website. They might have a business coach. They might go to see a copywriter. They might have a financial advisor or a kind of small business accountant.
[00:29:45] So a really good kind of exercise is to put your client in the middle and think about all the other services that they access, and then make your connections with those services.
[00:29:57] And then really just make it your mission to reach out to people every day. Do three a day, and I guarantee within two weeks your garden will be blooming, those seeds would've taken root and there will be some green shoots happening. So yeah, that's my advice.
Connect with Rachael
[00:30:20] Samantha Mabe: Awesome. Where can people connect with you to learn more about what you do and your approach and how you build these relationships?
[00:30:29] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: I'm at FeedMarketing.gg and I hang out on LinkedIn mainly, Instagram also, but so much more LinkedIn just 'cause again, I'm having some great conversations with people there.
[00:30:42] And I offer free marketing clarity calls that people can take up and come and talk to me about their niche or their messaging, or why is their content not working, or how do they find the people to connect with.
[00:30:56] And this again is back to that because I want to have connections with people. I think offering a something free is very rare. There's no strings to it. It's really just me and you having a chat about your work. I'm always up for people who want to jump on a free call with me and have a chat.
[00:31:18] Samantha Mabe: Awesome. We'll link to all of that in the show notes and people can connect with you. But thank you so much for coming on and chatting about this.
[00:31:25] Rachael Cumberland-Dodd: Thank you. It was brilliant. Really fun.
